Which island is right for me?

You are fortunate to have found this forum. I will give you a few bits of advice, but I am sure others will help you more. St John and St Thomas are not close enough to St Croix to consider living on one and working on the other. St Thomas is the "cheaper" living alternative while working on St John. I love St Croix, because it is very different from the rest of the USVI. It has great scenery,great beaches,great food and is less crowded than St Thomas or St John. Start from there. Get the Settlers Handbook and begin to ask questions. ASSUME NOTHING. Make some exploratory pre-move trips.

Don't think anything will be simple...it won't. Imagine complications and roadblocks. BUT..it is possible that one of these islands will be the place for you...

READ THE ARCHIVES OF THIS MESSAGE BOARD...!

Thanks! At first, I was a little disappointed that it didn't seem possible for me to live on St. John. But the more I read about St. Croix, the more I find that it might have more to offer me. In particular, it should be easier for me to find a teaching job on St. Croix. Other benefits of living on St. Croix (I assume, correct me if I'm wrong): More variety of people, merchandise, housing, and entertainment. Convenient to airport. I could teach at the University.
How is the dating scene on St. Croix?

hello erin...

i'm on stj now, though ive spent a good deal of time on all three islands. stj is a very very different island than the larger islands, but each does have its benefits.

as noted, stx is really inexpensive right now compared to stt/stj. just driving around on stx makes that very apparent-- as you can readily buy *acreage* there, not simply little tiny lots as it is on stj [where anything subdivideable is subdivided, quickly, to maximize sales profits =p]... you would have to add a zero to nearly every property on stx to bring them up to stj prices. stx also has some incredible beaches... despite living on an island with some of the most famous beautiful beaches in the world, there are still some great ones on stx... isaacs bay makes my top 5 easily. also, good hiking, good nature areas, good cheap eats, and many good people. if stj sank one day and i had to swim to my next choice, id start swimming south. stx is a worthy island, a very nice mix between the busy stt and lazy beautiful stj.

all those good things said, stx is in a little bit of a rut right now. i think the fact that it is currently the inexpensive choice will help it out-- many who cant afford stt/stj will choose that island and make it much better... but it will take some time. empty strip malls, that uneasy feeling of not being safe at all times, bars on all windows... it's not nearly as 'happy' of an island with itself as stj. but my overall biggest gripe with that island is its distance. something like 35 miles from the rest of the islands, aside from buck island, you cant just hop in a boat and go hopping around on neighboring islands for the day with the same ease as we can. it would be very difficult for me to trade in random weekend days lazing on jost or hanging out on tortola or weekend camping on the smaller bvis...

logistics stuff....
3k sounds to me to be a little generous for all the shipping, depending of course on how much stuff you have... =) cars seem to range from about $600 for shipping and taxes etc [old small nearly worthless cars] to around $1500 [bigger heavier trucks, still used, not too high of a blue book] ... you can easily add hundreds more in taxes if your car is worth a lot.
having animals does limit your rentability *some*, but not as much as it seems to in the states.

i hope ive provided more insight than confusion... but in the end, remember there is a reason that people pay huge sums of money to buy and even rent in stj... it's an incredible little island and id probably start pawning off internal organs before i was forced to move for $ reasons....
options: life on a boat? rent-share with annie [thats annie with mo the big black fuzzy dog? good kid =)]? rent and watch here for that incredible quick-moving locals only land deal for a quarter acre somewhere with no water views [yes it still occasionally happens, at rational costs], then put a quick shack on the land or a trailer and live like a redneck for a bit as you save up to really build....
just tossing those out... =)
good luck!

StX perspective because I've not been to StJ.
Teaching: In one of my premove visits I met a couple, quite young in early to mid 20's, who were both teachers. They had moved to StX last fall and were able to get jobs teaching for that school year. It seemed easy from thier experience. One of them had the skill of knowing American Sign L and was hired into the school due to that.
Natural Beauty: The east end of StX is brushy, prickly and sandy with more of a foothill pasture feeling. At the time of my visit it was rainy so the vegetation was lush and green. I hear it gets pretty arid and dry at times. The island, sweeping west gets lusher with more vegetation and large trees. The west end (northernly) has a tropical rainforest. Very beautiful and cool driving through this. The Salt River Area is protected as well as the rainforest area from my understanding. There is a botanical garden to volunteer at. Very gorgeous, using the natural elements of the island on an old sugar mill estate. For culture, there is the jazz concerts, Classical concerts at Estate Whim, Carnival to prepare for, BBQ at Protestant Cay on Tuesday nights (high Season, though).
Logistics: Mark and I have saved well over 10G for the move itself. A VW you are going to have to pay customs on as well as personal tax on book value and road tax on weight and the actual shipping charge. All the places I see to rent, the landlord wants first and last month upfront and a security deposit. Not sure of Estate Jealousy. Sorry. But you have to be aware of the fact that you need to be there. Its not like suburbia America. What might be completely wrong for you could be good for someone else. I'd rent first but all the animals will cause a problem and give you less options.
Island Hopping: During the low season, your choice is narrowed to air. Either StX to STT or Seaborne, downtown C'sted to Charlotte (I believe). During the High Season there is also the fast ferry which is like 65$ or such roundtrip.
Try calling Tropical or even Managed Frieght for getting estimates. A good resource for putting this togeather is www.viphonebook.com You can look up all the subjects and make as many calls as you want. My phone carrier out of Ohio gives me 05c a minute to call the VI. I love it. All I do is pick up the phone. If you have a Sprint Cell it also treats VI as on the National Plan.
Good Luck and feel free to keep asking away....

Triple homicide on STX last weekend. Number of murders on STX is now (in May) equal to that for all of 2003.

Oh right. I'm not supposed to mention that.

You can still get a condo for cheap, but desireable land and home prices have gone up.

Dating scene is non-existent unless you are 23 and looking for a no-strings hookup.

I know a number of people who have had little difficulty finding teaching positions. The private schools on STX (e.g., Good Hope, Country Day) are actually quite good.

It will cost you around $800 to ship your car with Tropical, but you will also have to shell out close to $400 in road tax, at least another $300 in mandatory insurance, plus pay duty on whatever the blue book value of your non-American-made car is, as well as another hundred bucks or so in registration and licensing fees. That is, if you decide to brave the DMV yourself. You can hire someone to stand in all those lines for you, but that will cost you more.

Living on STX differs significantly from living on STJ, most noticably in terms of infrastructure and relative wealth of inhabitants. STX does have some lovely remote, natural areas, however, you are cautioned not to visit them alone.

Best of luck with your plans.

Thanks so much everyone for all the comments!! Kudzu, that is so cool that you know my cousin!! (I just love her..and Mo!) The great news is that I haven't read anything that shocked me about the islands. Of course, the crime issues are a concern, but it seems like theft is the only REAL problem (as long as one makes responsible choices and stays aware of their surroundings). I'm not too worried about it, because I don't own much that anyone would want to steal and I have two large dogs and numerous personal alarms and such. I do plan to buy a safe, though. I went to law school in downtown Atlanta, and I imagine crime on STX can't be much worse than that.
I have located several small houses that interest me (for under $150,000). Hopefully, when I fly down to check them out, they won't turn out to be total dumps or in some scary location. Can anyone recommend a good property inspector and real estate attorney?
Sadly, I haven't read much that is positive about the dating scene. No worries, though. I guess I'll have more time to work on my tan and for volunteer activities. (:
Someone told me that I might not have to pay duty on my VW Jetta if it was manufactured in the US. I cannot imagine the car is worth that much, because it has nearly 100,000 miles on it and it is plastered in obnoxious, liberal bumperstickers (oh, how they delight me!). LOL, and let' s not forget the lovely key-job I received from some anonymous bitter folk.
VirginBound, thanks for the encouragement on finding a teaching job. I probably won't apply at private schools, though, because I really want to work with the poor population. When you say that STX and STJ are very different concerning wealth of inhabitants, do you mean that STJ has more wealthy folks and STX far less? If that is the case, I think STX would actually be a better match for me.
Oh, a few more questions...how easy is it to make purchases with credit card on the island? Will I have to carry cash much for shopping and dining? Are there any dog-friendly beaches on STX? What types of goods should I stock-up on and bring with me to save some money? Is there a crisis center or domstic shelter where I can volunteer?
Love, light, and Blessed Be!
Erin (:

VirginBound

Why doesn't everyone try to be a little more factual and a lot less lurid!

The triple murder was a domestic dispute resulting in the violent death of three people. To a uniformed reader of your post, it might seem that it was a cold-blooded killer stocking down his victims and slaying them. In the VI, as in most places, murders are committed by people who knew the victims. Doing drug deals also seems to put you at high risk of being murdered anywhere in the world.

There is too much crime in the VI, but it isn't particularly worse on one island versus another. During 2003 I believe there were more murders on STT than STX.

Neither island benefits when the thrust of our posts is trying to put the other islands in the USVI down. Crime is an issue that the police and the government need to do a better job in handling it. To some extent the government realizes this. When the Danish tourist arrived on St Croix in April there was a noticeable increase in the police patrols in Christiansted to deter the petty criminals.

Jim

Hello Erin,

You will not pay duty if the car is completely made in the USA. You will pay road tax and personal tax on it though.

Personal Use Tax; This tax is equivalent to the Value of the Car minus $1000 times 4%. The value of the car is determined by the Blue Book Value if the car is older or the purchase price for new cars. 16 cents per pound is the road tax.

I would suggest you apply at private and public schools that way you have options.
Whether St. John and St. Croix are very different as far as wealthy people; St. John has a far smaller population then St. Croix... a little over 4,000 people versus a littler over 53,000 people. St. John has very expensive real estate and appeals to wealthy people to invest in property (land, homes); these people do not make up the typical St. John population, in fact many of them use the homes as vacation homes rather then being permanent residents. There are certainly a large number of St. Johnians who are well off business owners, land owners or retirees and also a large number of middle class but there are also working class. St. John does have a more pricey cost of living because of real estate and apartments so is some what gentrified. St. Croix has more people period; so more people on welfare, more middle class, more working class, more wealthy people - because there are just more people. You will find a greater variety, range and quantity of people in different ecomonic situations in the residents of St. Croix then on St. John.

Credit Cards are easy, pretty much all establishments large and small accept them. A few places don't. Smaller vendors might have minimum purchase amounts for credit card use. There are ATM machines here as well.

Not sure about dog friendly beaches on St. Croix. There are a couple on St. Thomas; they aren't officially dog friendly but residents take their pups there in the early morning or late afternoon for a walk or swim.

Stocking up on goods to bring with... Not sure its worth it if you are shipping the stuff. You might look at the cost of living section of this web site at the grocery store list and see what the prices are. If you mean other items (cloths, music ect - specify what you are considering so folks can give feedback).

Yes there are shelters.

A tip: Be careful how you say "I really want to work with the poor population". You would quickly get cursed for saying this comment regardless of whether "poor" was a true reflection of the individual's economic situation. While there are many places you can volunteer and help; people in the Virgin Islands and very much the Caribbean don't like the idea that "outsiders" are coming to save the day. And to associate public schools with being poor .... eeek! While your assistance is welcomed be aware of your approach or more so the way you verbalize your wanting to volunteer and help as not to doom your efforts before you ever get started.

--Islander

Sorry for any confusion. Thanks for bringing this issue to the table. You are correct to raise questions about my choice of vocabulary.
I was actually trying to associate wealth with private schools more than poverty with public schools. I've attended public schools all my life, both by circumstance and by choice. I know there is a diverse socio-economic population in many public schools.
In no way was I associating poverty with native Islanders.
I completely agree with you about perspective and helping. I teach a couse at the local college called "Community Involvement" that is a service-learning course. We have several readings, including: "To Hell With Good Intentions" and "Why Servanthood is Bad" that cover the issue of unhealthy service through the perspective of superiority. I harbor no illusions about coming to the US Virgin Islands to "save the day." In fact, I recognize that the residents have far more to offer and teach me than I could ever offer or teach them. Yet, I am committed to service where I can offer service. In making my comparison, I merely wanted to express my preference to teach where there is a greater need. Traditionally, public schools have a severe shortage of teachers and resources.
My desire to "work with the poor" does not begin with the US Vigin Islands. I have taught in the public schools of a poor, rural farming community on the mainland. I volunteer as a mentor for poor, at-risk youth. I have worked as a Public Defender and Juvenile Public Defender, representing America's poor and defending constitutional liberties.
My interest in the Virgin Islands is not based on a belief that something is broken and needs to be fixed. Rather, I hope to renew my own spiritual peace in a place where natural beauty and simple pleasures abound.
Namaste,
Erin (:

Erin,

Do I understand correctly that you gave up the practice of law to teach?

I'm jealous...

Post Edited (05-18-04 11:15)

Okay. You know what? I live on STX. STX is my HOME. I love the place. I'm not being LURID. I'm not putting my island "down." I'm being DIRECT about the reality of life on that island and the fact that it isn't going to be what most people who've never lived there think it is. The fact that the triple murder was a family issue does not detract from the fact that MOST TOWNS WITH POPULATIONS THE SIZE OF STX DO NOT HAVE THE HOMICIDES STX DOES!

Before I moved to STX, I lived in a medium-sized (pop. 300K), urban, state-capitol, college town. In 2002, THREE PEOPLE were murdered there. THREE. You know how many on STX that same year? TWENTY-FOUR.

The reality is that life is different in a place where people are routinely killed, beaten, and raped, EVEN IF you personally are not a likely target. I feel differently, act differently, regard strangers differently when walking in downtown F'sted or C'sted (pop. 3K) at night compared to walking in my stateside downtown (pop. 300K) at night. I'm more cautious, less relaxed, watchful and tense on STX than I have EVER been in my hometown. Does that mean you can't survive and be happy there? Absolutely not. Would I want to know this so that I don't make the assumption that C'sted is akin to other small, rural 3K-populated towns scattered all over the U.S.? Abso-freakin-loutely.

My presentation of unpleasant information should not be construed as disparagement. PEOPLE HAVE A RIGHT TO KNOW THESE THINGS. If you don't care, good for you, but don't chastise me for thinking some people might.

VirginBound,
I agree with you that persons considering relocating miles away from friends and family and all they know should be apprised of the truth about the potential of violence in their new community. They should know where they should not walk at night because there is a history of attacks or where they may not want to live because of the frequency of burglaries.
That said, andperhaps I have misunderstood, but do you really think that the horrible events on STX on Saturday have contributed to your "feel[ing] differently, act[ing] differently, and regard[ing] strangers differently" when walking in F'sted or C'sted?
While it certainly contributed to the murder rate of 2004, by all accounts this was not a random act of violence or a crime targeted against a stranger.
I think it is unfair and inflammatory to equate this particular act with why a person visiting STX should feel more cautious, less relaxed, and more watchful and tense.

Post Edited (05-18-04 11:40)

This is a perfect example of why a forum such as this one is so effective...everyone can share their particular opinion/experience/perspective and we are all free to interpret as we choose. I think everyone makes a valid point. Onika sums it up well. I don't think Board participants should criticize VirginBound for offering her perspective, but I agree wholeheartedly with Jim that partial information is misinformation. Yet, any misunderstandings that could result from that perspective can easily be balanced by the variety of perspectives presented on the Board. I'm sure we all have a different perspective on personal safety that is shaped by our age, , and experiences.

Onika,
LOL, technically, yes, I gave up the practice of law to return to the classroom. (not that the pay is much different since I was a public defender) However, I actually attended law school with no intention to practice law. I just found the law very intriguing and loved the debates. There is something very humbling about the environment of law school where every student is forced to consider, and often argue, an issue from both sides.
Living my truth, following my bliss...
Namaste,
Erin (:

Apparently, in my last posting I should have used the term "gender" to refer to one of the many influences that shape our perspectives. I didn't realize that "S-X" is an inappropriate word in this forum. (chuckle)

I agree that the facts are the best things to work with.
This year so far there have been 10 homicides on STX and 16 total in the islands
last yar there were a total of 29 on the VIs and 9 on St. Croix.
The bady years appears to be 200s when there were 42 VI homicides in the territories and 23 of them were in STX.
Info came from stcroixsource.com click on the data link. A summary of the deaths does give one the idea if you are not out after 2 a.m. and not doing drug deals you are not going to get shot, but it doesn't guarantee it.
db

Erin,

My husband and I are moving to STX on the 29th - I'm bringing my job as the online communications director for a criminal justice reform advocacy group with me to the islands. You sound like someone I should get to know and should shamefully recruit to get involved with our issues. *wink*

Sure hope you do end up in STX -- would love to meet you and know that you're around. Anyone who went to law school because they loved the subject and the art of debate, defended our consitutional liberties as a public defender (I used to work for the ACLU's legisaltive office in DC), teaches, and has a burning desire to give back is my idea of a good friend and neighbor.

Good luck on making your decisions -- would be happy to share our knowledge and overall impressions of the decision-making and moving processes from the perspective of big-city folks who are moving to this small island community and intend to stay for good.

HipCrip

Check out all three Islands and get the feeling from yourself. Your heart will tell you where you want to live. I, personally love St Croix, for many reasons. If you are into the dating scene, St John is really small and you might find it difficult to meet lots of singles. there. I went to the USVI and stayed for 7 years, I lived on all three, but My heart belongs to St. Croix. Check it out. K

Hi Erin,
Your message sounds like you are very excited about relocating to the V.I. We will be happy to have you here.

I want to touch on one issue that most of your replies did not - The pets. The big dogs in particular may be a challange getting here. The airlines have restrictions on the time of year that pets can travel (no summer months where the temperature in the cargo hold is above 80-something degrees), and the maximum weight of the pet. My last information is that the maximum weight of pet with pet carrier is 100Lbs. Traveling with the pets can also be costly, and moving with 6 at one time is probably not possible, and will definately put you over your moving budget. Once you vist the islands in June and come closer to a decision on the one best for you, I will be happy to try and guide you to the best choice in air carrier.

With regard to the vehcles and HHG, you might be able to make the move with a $3,000.00 budget for vehicle and HHG. One thing that Tropical's estimator will not tell you is about the taxes, duties, and registration fees that you wil be responsible for once you arrive on island - any island. These taxes are substantial and cannot be ignored. Message me back when you are ready and we will take a closer look at your costs to determine is 3 grand will cut it.

Enjoy your time in the V.I. - Welcome.

Lee

HipCrip,
Aw, shucks! (blush) Thanks!
Please tell me more about the program you mentioned. It definitely sounds like something I may be interested in. Although I do not intend to practice law in the Virgin Islands (or anywhere for that matter), reforming our criminal justice system is one of my passions. I had eventually hoped to work on that in government, but the idea of having to play the politics game in order to get in there and make some positive change is a little discouraging at times.
I wish you the best of luck on your upcoming move and I look forward to being your neighbor!
Namaste,
Erin (:

Lee,
Thanks so much for looking out for my furry friends!
My cousin Annie, who lives on St. John with her big dog Mo, has shared much of that information with me. She said that some airlines do fly pets during the summer on night flights, though. I wouldn't dream of flying my dogs in the heat of the summer day even if there were no restrictions! As for my cats, I am going to use carry-on luggage made for transporting pets. I can fit two cats per bag once they are happily ged. (:
And then I can just slide them under the chir in front of me. It's only a 3 and a half hour flight from Orlando. If it doesn't work out for some reason, though, my parents are going to watch my pets in their Florida home until I can fly back to get them in the Fall. I hadn't heard anything about a weight restriction. Are you sure that applies to all airlines? My Retreiver is only 63 lbs, so she's set, but my Lab-mix is about 90 lbs. I guess I'll start her doggy-diet now. (:
Why is traveling with pets costly if they are considered luggage? I expect to pay a little more to bring extra luggage on the plane, but the vast majority of my stuff will be shipped. As far as my moving budget, I'm not limited to $3,000, but that was just what I had heard was the going rate for a car and a small household.
Thanks again for all the information! I look forward to meeting you! Right now, I'm leaning towatd STX as my new home.
Namaste,
Erin (:

A realistic budget for moving a car from Florida to the VI is at least $2,000.

Ocean Freight $800 (Depends on size of the car )

Use Tax $280 ($8,000 Blue book - $1,000 x 4%)

Road Tax $640 ($0.16 per lb)

Registration & Fees $200

Duty ??? If it isn't a US manufactured car

FYI you also will be charged the 4% use tax on the value of any household items you ship to the VI.

Jim

Hi Jim,
I have heard about this 4% tax on used household items. What exactly is taxed? Do you mean furniture, appliances, clothes, etc.? I am going to inventory my things and hopefully have an estimate of their worth for insurance reasons, but I didn't fully understand what was being taxed.
Thank you.
Teresa

About putting 2 cats per carrier under your seat....The new rules are...be very careful to check with the airline before yo try to take them. Only 2 animals are allowed per cabin per flight. They are required to have their own carrier. One per carrier. But this includes 1st class and business and economy. Since 911 lots of things have changed with regard to travel including animals. I am speaking from personal experience not just guessing. You do have to book your animals at the time of the flight and tell them exactly how many and how they are flying. It used to be easy, just take off with them, but not any longer. Good luck. K

Erin:
We flew down in July 2002 with 3 cats in the cabin. I had 2 cats in one carrier under one seat and my husband had the other. Lots of kitty anti-anxiety meds were necessary. Not one airline attendant asked to see the animals or checked how many were in each carrier, although I had paid for 3. They did have a maximum of, I beleive, 5 animals per cabin. You do have to book your animals at the time you book your flight b/c the animal max. is first come, first served. Not sure if the rules have changed since 7/02, but that was our experience. Try the smaller airlines. Good luck.