St. Croix Self-Governance Movement?

It appears to be for real. I don't know how successful it will be, but the Crucians are really cheesed at the government. Even Roger W. Morgan on Mongoose radio is pushing it.

heh. i hope st john follows suit and stops subsidizing the other two islands... 😉

From everything I've read being cheesed is more than understandable. Turnbull's administration and VI government in general has been an embarrassment to say the least. And with the current economic climate STX is undoubtedly suffering the worst hit.

But I can't imagine what the Secessionists see as a solution. Are they seriously proposing that STX secede from U.S. territorial status or am I missing something? Recreating all of the government entities that the three islands now share the cost of and footing the bill themselves would be nonsense. No Federal funds -- who do they think is going to pay for all of this -- Hovensa? The casinos? Tourism? (Not likely -- STX already gets far less tourist trade than STT or STJ and with additional visa requirements it could only get worse...) And do they seriously expect an Independent Republic of St. Croix to be immune from the culture that created the existing mess? The whole idea seems like leaping from a cliff to avoid a brush fire to me...

While it would not be the best thing for ALL of the USVI, the idea of St Croix becoming independent from St Thomas and St John (mostly St Thomas) has much appeal. It is obvious that St Croix has never had it's fair share of the the of the revenue or legislation that would help the whole territory grow. St Thomas cruise business is the "tail that wags the dog". It is vitally important to the economic health of the USVI. However, St Croix has been given the ":short end of the stick" for far too many years. Even with it's larger population and oil generated income (Hovensa) almost twice as much money is spent by the Virgin Island Senate on St thomas...Something is wrong with this picture...
I support St Croix secession, not for practical reasons, but because I am tired of the petty political control that makes St Croix a second class place. Bad policing, bad sewers (infrastructure), bad tourist support ,and corrupt senators manipulating the everyday life. Obviously an "indepent republic is not the answer...but if we could be a seperate US territory..?

Sometimes the brush fire looks better thyan the quagmire.

What an interesting political can of worms. You could also point out that the VI is being taxed illegally by the federal gov't. Taxation w/o representation is against the law last I heard. Kind of like DC. Does the VI have a voice in congress? I know that there isn't a vote but is there representation on the federal level?

Seems like I remember reading that the territory didn't even elect there own representaion in local gov't until the early 70's. (Organic act?) I know that the infastructure of the islands were different back then, (sugar instead of tourism?) but has STX's being overlooked financially been a progresive process that has happened over time or has it been predominant with Turnbull's administration. Were things legislated better when the fed's were in charge or is that like comparing apples and oranges because of the amount of time that has passed since the first gubenatorial election?

Maybe California has something by trying to get rid of Gray Davis, seems like from what I have read, that even though Turnbull was reelected he doesn't seem too popular. It appears that (based on what I've read in the vi daily news) that Turnbull has his own agenda and the legislature is having problems getting things done because of it. Is this an accurate observation?

I don't know enough (obviously!) to have a valid opinion, but I find this subject very interesting and would like to know why Crucian's don't feel like they have a voice. It sounds like it is a widely supported concept to secede which is a huge thing and probably wasn't concieved with out reason. What has led up to this organization of Crucians to secede because they feel that they can't succeed collectively with STT and STJ. I know money is the major issue but please fill me in on any and all points of view.

The secession proposal is to amend the Organic Act of 1954 to allow St. Croix to become a separate US Territory. The petition is as follows:

"I the undersigned citizen of ________________, who has a vested interest in the island of St. Croix in the territory of the U. S. Virgin Islands, request that you amend the Organic Act of 1954 to make St. Croix a separate territory of the United States of America. It has become increasingly difficult for St. Croix to grow and prosper under the current form of government.

"The citizens of St. Croix wish to administer their own affairs and not be obliged to ask elected St. Thomas/St. John officials for approval on issues that impact every aspect of their lives.

"I request the residents of St. Croix have the right to elect a governor, lieutenant governor and five senators who will reside on St. Croix and manage the island’s affairs. The residents of St. Croix desire to maintain a tri-island election for delegate to Congress. The population does not warrant another delegate.

"The residents of St. Croix request that all revenues derived on St. Croix are retained on that island. "

The USVI currently has a a delegate to Congress, as mentioned above. The last sentence of the petition is the key - the main bone to pick is that St. Croix businesses, principally Hovensa (Hess) and the Cruzan Rum distillery pay the majority of taxes used to fund the government in St. Thomas, yet (as mentioned in an earlier post) St. Croix receives a far lower percentage of public services - including infrastructure improvements, police and tourism promotion. The residents want to take control of their own fate with the revenues generated on island.

If St. Croix were to be successful in that attempt it would be a huge revenue loss to the remaining two islands which I doubt the US government would allow. Thus, I suspect this petition is an attempt to force a more equitable distribution of power and revenue within the USVI.

Isn't it a fact that St Croix has seven senators that represent that island in the VI legislature. Why is it then that those senators are not being held accountable for what happens on St Croix. Why is St thomas always has be blamed for the problems of St Croix. If I am not mistaken and anyone can correct me if I am wrong, between Hovensa and the Rum industry on the island of St Croix they generate about 100 million in tax revenues. The total budget for the government of VI is approximately 500 million gave or take. I was wondering were is the rest of the money is coming from if not from St thomas and St John. I am sure that St Croix contributes more than the 100 million to the budget but it is a fact that the majority of the revenues generated in the VI comes from St Thomas and St John. If the majority of Cruzians feels that secession is the answer to St Croix problems so be it, at least St thomas wouldn't be blamed anymore for the problems on St Croix. Why is it that the people of St Croix feels that they are in competition with St Thomas. Truly, St thomas is not the competition, it is the other surrounding caribbean islands. We as Virgin Islanders should be proud that at least one of our islands is holding its own in stiff competitive tourism market. There is only one VI treasury as far as I know.

All points are well argued and despite differences in opinion quite civil to one another. This is a terrific board! I deeply appreciate all of your input.

On reading the Avis ad I had a suspicion that the deeper intent of the movement might be to force attention to the problems, making it clear to VI government as a whole that the people of STX are more than a little miffed. From at least one comment here it would seem there is at least some merit to that perception, and to me it would appear that there is even some merit to the concept. After all, until someone tells the engineer that the bridge is out, the train is far too likely to keep going in the same ugly direction. This is one way to yank the emergency cord.

On the other hand it also appears that those who take the movement more seriously actually expect to be able to remove STX from the other two islands' political structure while retaining US territorial status. Without access to all of the facts this seems highly unlikely to me as an outsider. If enough Cruzians signed the petition to get the attention of the Federal government, the likely outcome would be Federal intervention in VI government as a whole rather than a new political entity which US tax dollars would have to support. I think I can safely say the historical pattern supports this attitude from Washington even within the full member states (although prior to 9/11 some mainlanders would have preferred to call New York a renegade territory) and the District of Columbia as well. Furthermore, I doubt that even once the attention of Washington was raised to the issue that STX would be perceived as being Cinderella, innocently and powerlessly being abused by her evil stepsisters until her fairy godmother comes along to save her and turn her into a princess.

So, my next question: Assuming the founders of the Secessionist movement are serious and well reasoned ladies and gentlemen, have any of them discussed the separate US territory idea with anyone of authority in Washington? If so, who? And what was the feedback? In other words, even if they make it clear to Washington that something needs to be done, on what basis do they expect a vote of two Republican houses of Congress and a Republican White House to favor an amendment creating a new US territory with all the financial responsibility that entails?

I also get the impression from your posts that depending on which island you reside, each feels that more of the financial burden of the Territory is being unequally paid by your island and unequally distributed to the others. Is this a fair statement?

Going to try and answer some questions each of you asked and add to it a bit...

David in your first post... I think you have gained the answer from the other post already; they don't want to succeed from the "union" but gain control of their government without answering to or with the St. Thomas/St.John senators or goverment. As far as separating there was a movement several years back, quite a few years actually where there was talk of the USVI changing its territorial status, well some residents were talking about and it was voted on... but that is something completely different.

and in your second post David... you bring up many fine questions... not sure who they have spoken to or who they are working with in Congress or in Washington.. perhaps someone else can fill in who is running this movement.

As far as each island feeling they produce more then they get back less then their fair share.... well that has always existed to some degree... some folks say that St. Thomas uses St. John in terms of the lure St. John has to visitors... St. Thomas folks might say that they are the attraction and why interfere with that -St. Croix can be the industrial spot and St. Thomas the tourist destination... that being an excuse for what seems to be a lack of effort to improve tourism conditions on St. Croix among other infrastructure concerns... even during hurricane Hugo recovery I recall discussions concerning the idea that St. Thomas was getting more assistance then St. Croix although St. Croix was more damaged... and St. Johnians saying it was taking a while for St. Thomas to send help over there... and then the little sister Water Island, well their 161 or so residents to some extent just take care of their own things, fix their own roads and bill public works as I understand, clean their own island, residents volunteer to do things like provide emergency boat service to St. Thomas should medical emergencies arrise, and have a resident contact system in cases of emergenicies... and little involvement at all exist from VI government and all three of the other islands would likely say to that "do people live there??"... It could be easily compared to 4 sisters... one might think that they should get along because they are family however they each are individuals and different... the USVI islands have always had issues between the sister islands however I would say they stood together all the same... The inefficiency of the government effects all the islands but seemingly more on some then others. St. Croix has reached the last straw I think and they want things to change and improve and rightly so; although I might add that it should be the USVI residents as a whole that should want the government as a whole to change and improve the USVI together and not separately; having collective efforts put forth by residents to change things or take a stand against something or for; is something truly rare in the VI... (that is of course my opinion)

Elle Rock - The VI has a delegate to Congress - non-voting like you said. She has a web site at http://www.house.gov/christian-christensen/ if you want to check it out.
Historical overview - yes the Vi elected its own gov't around 1968 or thereabout. Before that the Federal government appointed a governing person (1936-68) and prior to that was the US Dept. of the Interior (1931-36) and between 1917-1931 the Navy administered the island and of course prior to 1917 the Danish owned and operated things and the leadership was generally appointed. As for the infrastructure being different - yes it was.. but sugar had declined long before 1970 - more like mid/late-1800's... the economy and population around that time was in decline. As for issues existing in the government and issues between sister islands existing just now or being progressive - I would say progressive... as for suceeding again not from the USA but from USVI present government system...

Very very interesting topic, must agree.

--Islander

Thank you so much for weighing in, Islander. Your insightful "insider" knowledge of VI history, commerce and culture always adds valuable perspective to any discussion, particularly one with such diverse viewpoints. And you have a remarkable knack for maintaining a "fair and balanced" (please feel free to sue me, Fox News!) political position. 🙂

Islander, you couldn't have expressed my own feelings more aptly. Since you have taken the liberty of expressing your thoughts, I'd like to take the soapbox as well. (Just to be clear, from here on I'm editorializing and these are strictly my own opinions. I apologize in advance for offending anyone's sensibilities but nevertheless I stand for my thoughts..)

The problems speak -- no, SCREAM -- for themselves. Even as a complete outsider it is quite apparent that the USVI is headed toward a disaster that could make Hugo and Marilyn feel like mosquito bites if the government's fumbling mismanagement isn't addressed fairly soon. And while imbalances in dealing with problems certainly exist from island to island -- and I have little doubt in my mind that in many cases STX is certainly on the "short end of the stick" (as Real Truth? put it) -- it's clear to me that the problem is really a USVI problem, not a STX or STT or STJ problem.

I hope to be an islander soon, and my general bent has been to be a Cruzian. Although I'm painfully aware of many of the issues STX has had to deal with (20% unemployment, tourism problems, VIHA issues, WAPA issues, mismanagement of the Salt Pond Preserve, sewage system problems near "Condo Row", issues with the public schools, etc.), it still seems quite apparent to me that all Virgin Islanders need to work together to solve the problems of an out-of-touch and self-serving local government structure. I have proudly considered myself to be "not all there" enough to be a Virgin Islander, but if the feelings of the Secessionists represent the feelings of Cruzians as a whole, perhaps I should reconsider my allegiance and think about STT instead...

Getting involved in quarrels between islands only splits up the energy that could be exerted toward practical and sensible change. Without full support of Washington, any effort at secession on STX's part will just derail and leave VI residents on every island one step further away from a real solution. I would much rather see a unified USVI movement aimed directly at the stagnant and corrupt local governmental structure. Once the people have the attention of government (whether Federal or local), we can then begin finding a way to make sure future government operations are balanced fairly between the USVI's citizenship.

Ultimately, it seems to me that what really needs to be decided is how much Federal intervention islanders want. Unless I'm very much mistaken, one way or another it's coming. The longer it takes to unify and take serious action, the longer Washington will want to be in charge once they finally come in and the longer it will take to mop up the mess.

OK, the soapbox is now vacant. Next? 🙂

Two small opinions: 1. re: the idea that we are getting taxed without representation...The tax system which mirrors the US system actually leaves ALL the money here. The money that the VI gets from the feds is in addition to our tax money. Hence the old joke, where your stateside tax dollars go for vacation! 2. Why aren't the senators held accountable? The voting system is at-large. A slate of people run and you get to select up to 7 names from that list. You cannot vote no to anyone. A candidate just has to get X number of votes to get elected. Many do this by "bullet" voting- they ask voters to vote for them and only for them, effectively diluting the voting strength. You are "beholdin" to him, but he doesn't have any specific constituency. My soap box-we must have districts if we are to get accountability.

Well said David!! There is a want for things to improve HOWEVER the inefficiencies do not operate in one direction; its a pattern... the leaders hand that is buttered also butters those close to him and perhaps the families of those close to him and perhaps the friends and definately those who generously supported him/her so creating a great system of nepotism; (definately doesn't only happen here) Although WE collectively may want things to change.... the voices that make up that "we" when heard alone might whisper something that sounds a bit different. The individual voices might say things that sound like they individually might benefit from the way things run now and if things were to run effectively perhaps they individually would not benefit any longer, although we (the whole population as a whole) might.

And as I said before and you said also; if all the residents of the islands were to stand together for change that movement would be much better placed to benefit the USVI as a whole, rather then setting one island up against the other literally and in terms of the government operations.

--Islander

East Ender,
That is very cool that the tax dollars stay in the USVI! Thanks for telling me (and others)that. Also educational; the way the vote is cast. Didn't know that either! I can see where that kind of a voting system eliminates accountability. I'm loving this post, because it has the feel of people looking for a solution.

I'm going to stay off the soap box because I don't know anything but what I've read, but I read something one time that talked about the power of the masses and the quote is as follows...

"United we stand, divided we beg"

David and Islander and others who commented,
Wow, great and insightful opinions! I have learned a lot from this post.

As a STJ resident, I feel that it is correct that each island *believes* it could make it better on its own. I also feel that the reason STT is doing better than STX is because
of STJ. STX doesnt have a small island to exploit like STT does to STJ. If you take STJ out of STT's picture, I think you might have another STX. STT has average beaches.
STT has a decent amount of crime. STJ is really an ATTRACTION of STT. When people get a small taste of STJ, they want to spend more time here. What does draw people to STT? The jewlery shops? The beaches? The weather? Lets be honest, one or two days are spent checking out STJ. STX problems arent the government, anymore than the other two islands.
The problem won't be solved by getting the US govt involved. The problem is that the island needs to deal with the crime and then turn towards attracting people there. IMO, STT needs to start dealing with their crime and drugs, too.