racism on the islands

OT I re-read your post and yes in this case you actually did not accuse others of not doing anything to better the world, however my quick reaction to your post was due to the fact that in the past, you have frequently made those accusations.

it's the millenials such as yourself who'll essentially "save" the islands .

isn't that just how the math works?

OT you don't know what any one of us does or does not do, to better the lot of others, so it's not nice to tell people to stop blustering and shouting. We might, each of us in our own way, do good deeds.

RIght. I don't respond to those "what have you done" posts because: (1) they're stupid, as anyone can lie on the internet; (2) they're completely ad hominem (latin, just for you, OldFart) and irrelevant to the merits of the issue at hand; and (3) they would lead many of us to "out" ourselves publicly. I'm not sure why people get so persnickety during intellectual exchanges.

This has been a very useful dialogue, though. It is interesting to see the perspective of those who see the West Indians as the ones in "power" due to their representation in government positions. I have always seen the yacht owners at Yacht Haven or the property owners in Shoys, etc as the real elite class. A political scientist might agree with the former perspective, while an economist might agree with the latter. Neither of these positions is absurd, although I suspect the property owner in Shoys would not trade in their house for a seat in the Senate, while I suspect that most Senators would trade in their seat for the elite property. In other words, as a young VI'er, my aspiration has always been to one day own a boat nice enough to win a boating competition or to teach my future kids to sail, etc. Not to be elected to the Zoo (Senate). WIth money, I'd be able to finance campaigns anyway (cue Randy Knight-the true VI power broker!). It's all a matter of perspective. Love the elevated level of discourse here.

-M

Nothing like examining House of Cards to understand the difference between power and money.

"Money is the Mc-mansion in Sarasota that starts falling apart after 10 years. Power is the old stone building that stands for centuries. I cannot respect someone who doesn't see the difference."

I do believe the West Indian elitists understand the nature of power.

OT I re-read your post and yes in this case you actually did not accuse others of not doing anything to better the world, however my quick reaction to your post was due to the fact that in the past, you have frequently made those accusations.

That's not true either. What I have commented on (and not "accused") is that many people are quick to run onto a forum to complain about so much but do nothing practical to offer a solution to the problem(s).

PS: Up pops that smiley icon again which is typed as the closing bracket! :D:D:D

it's the millenials such as yourself who'll essentially "save" the islands .

isn't that just how the math works?

Take something out of context and look what happens ...

OT that is basically saying the same thing. How do you know whether any of the complaining posters have done anything to fix the situations that they complain about?

OT that is basically saying the same thing. How do you know whether any of the complaining posters have done anything to fix the situations that they complain about?

Maybe a faulty presumption but nonetheless a viable one. If they do or have done something constructive to address the issue or have a suggestion on how to fix it then it doesn't seem so far-fetched to assume that they would share their thoughts. Seems pretty logical to me.

OT you don't know what any one of us does or does not do, to better the lot of others, so it's not nice to tell people to stop blustering and shouting. We might, each of us in our own way, do good deeds.

RIght. I don't respond to those "what have you done" posts because: (1) they're stupid, as anyone can lie on the internet; (2) they're completely ad hominem (latin, just for you, OldFart) and irrelevant to the merits of the issue at hand; and (3) they would lead many of us to "out" ourselves publicly. I'm not sure why people get so persnickety during intellectual exchanges.

This has been a very useful dialogue, though. It is interesting to see the perspective of those who see the West Indians as the ones in "power" due to their representation in government positions. I have always seen the yacht owners at Yacht Haven or the property owners in Shoys, etc as the real elite class. A political scientist might agree with the former perspective, while an economist might agree with the latter. Neither of these positions is absurd, although I suspect the property owner in Shoys would not trade in their house for a seat in the Senate, while I suspect that most Senators would trade in their seat for the elite property. In other words, as a young VI'er, my aspiration has always been to one day own a boat nice enough to win a boating competition or to teach my future kids to sail, etc. Not to be elected to the Zoo (Senate). WIth money, I'd be able to finance campaigns anyway (cue Randy Knight-the true VI power broker!). It's all a matter of perspective. Love the elevated level of discourse here.

-M

Nothing like examining House of Cards to understand the difference between power and money.

"Money is the Mc-mansion in Sarasota that starts falling apart after 10 years. Power is the old stone building that stands for centuries. I cannot respect someone who doesn't see the difference."

I do believe the West Indian elitists understand the nature of power.

Haha! Love Ole Frank, but I must disagree with him. In the 21st century, money = freedom. It allows you a high quality of living and the ability to provide the best opportunities for one's children. Political power (outside perhaps the very high offices like POTUS) is fleeting, and increasingly not worth the personal and professional sacrifice. Marco Rubio is financially enslaved (debt), and Scott Walker has borrowed over 100k to send his kids to college. Martin O'Malley owes over $340,000 in PLUS loans for his kids' educations. I wish Remy Danton was given to to opportunity to retort. LOL.

An aside: Perhaps these Senators should have considered using their popularity and "talent" to start businesses to employ the youth. Maybe then, they wouldn't have to use their Gov positions to hire all their cousins, etc. Since Mapp is so "brilliant," perhaps he should have created a private company to employ his family members and provide him the Admiral's Club memberships, luxury sheets, etc. he desires. We now have public sector officials with private sector dreams--a true catalyst for corruption.

OT you don't know what any one of us does or does not do, to better the lot of others, so it's not nice to tell people to stop blustering and shouting. We might, each of us in our own way, do good deeds.

RIght. I don't respond to those "what have you done" posts because: (1) they're stupid, as anyone can lie on the internet; (2) they're completely ad hominem (latin, just for you, OldFart) and irrelevant to the merits of the issue at hand; and (3) they would lead many of us to "out" ourselves publicly. I'm not sure why people get so persnickety during intellectual exchanges.

This has been a very useful dialogue, though. It is interesting to see the perspective of those who see the West Indians as the ones in "power" due to their representation in government positions. I have always seen the yacht owners at Yacht Haven or the property owners in Shoys, etc as the real elite class. A political scientist might agree with the former perspective, while an economist might agree with the latter. Neither of these positions is absurd, although I suspect the property owner in Shoys would not trade in their house for a seat in the Senate, while I suspect that most Senators would trade in their seat for the elite property. In other words, as a young VI'er, my aspiration has always been to one day own a boat nice enough to win a boating competition or to teach my future kids to sail, etc. Not to be elected to the Zoo (Senate). WIth money, I'd be able to finance campaigns anyway (cue Randy Knight-the true VI power broker!). It's all a matter of perspective. Love the elevated level of discourse here.

-M

Nothing like examining House of Cards to understand the difference between power and money.

"Money is the Mc-mansion in Sarasota that starts falling apart after 10 years. Power is the old stone building that stands for centuries. I cannot respect someone who doesn't see the difference."

I do believe the West Indian elitists understand the nature of power.

Haha! Love Ole Frank, but I must disagree with him. In the 21st century, money = freedom. It allows you a high quality of living and the ability to provide the best opportunities for one's children. Political power (outside perhaps the very high offices like POTUS) is fleeting, and increasingly not worth the personal and professional sacrifice. Marco Rubio is financially enslaved (debt), and Scott Walker has borrowed over 100k to send his kids to college. Martin O'Malley owes over $340,000 in PLUS loans for his kids' educations. I wish Remy Danton was given to to opportunity to retort. LOL.

An aside: Perhaps these Senators should have considered using their popularity and "talent" to start businesses to employ the youth. Maybe then, they wouldn't have to use their Gov positions to hire all their cousins, etc. Since Mapp is so "brilliant," perhaps he should have created a private company to employ his family members and provide him the Admiral's Club memberships, luxury sheets, etc. he desires. We now have public sector officials with private sector dreams--a true catalyst for corruption.

Those sums owed by those you listed above are really very little in the scope of things. And certainly very little compared to the opportunities their political aspirations will bring them - talking about Rubio and Walker in particular. Is it worth a few hundred thousand in debt to pursue enough power and reputation to command several hundred thousand for one speaking gig in the future? You bet.

Rubio and Walker got time on stage before a national audience, not matter how little chance either has/had to be elected POTUS. Both also now can rightfully contribute to the national dialogue based upon this experience, not their credentials. They can now rub shoulders with the Koch boys who successfully wield both money and power without bounds.

Money is fleeting - comes and goes - but power can change the dialogue for a person and his/her family for many generations.

Full Definition of RACISM

1: a belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and capacities and that racial differences produce an inherent superiority of a particular race

2: racial prejudice or discrimination

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/racism

The definition of racism has nothing to do with wealth or money.
If you believe it does then you need to show us where you get your definition.

OT I re-read your post and yes in this case you actually did not accuse others of not doing anything to better the world, however my quick reaction to your post was due to the fact that in the past, you have frequently made those accusations.

That's not true either. What I have commented on (and not "accused") is that many people are quick to run onto a forum to complain about so much but do nothing practical to offer a solution to the problem(s).

PS: Up pops that smiley icon again which is typed as the closing bracket! :D:D:D

Kind of like progressives wanting to spend other peoples money to correct social injustice but not their own. Show us by example instead of lecturing us.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWXZ-whusxY

This is my thoughts on this entire conversation along with every other internet argument. It's pointless to have these discussions when both sides only dig in deeper to their original positions without actually listening or using empathy as a tool in conversing with someone that has a differing view.

Dumber

No video of Dinesh D'Souza pleading guilty to one felony count of making illegal contributions in the names of others?

This is my thoughts on this entire conversation along with every other internet argument. It's pointless to have these discussions when both sides only dig in deeper to their original positions without actually listening or using empathy as a tool in conversing with someone that has a differing view.

Dumber

(tu)(tu)(tu)

EXACTLY!!!!! Ask trayvon martin!!!

Why don't we ask ourselves why, in the USVI, that many people, black or white, tourist or local, don't feel safe everywhere on our islands after dark in certain areas

Y'all prefer not having gun control.
There are consequences.
Right or wrong, lives are irreparably lost and damaged.

Here, gangs and guns are responsible for the majority of lost lives.
Don't bring Treyvon Martin into the mix because it's complicated and comparing apples to breadfruit.

It's obvious that racism is endemic in all cultures.

I felt the need to create an account and post just for a more recent refresh on this topic. I moved to STX a few years back and have experienced direct prejudice/tribalism and anti-transplant sentiment here since the very beginning of my transplant. It is to the point where I will probably leave in the next year or two despite loving my small community. I am relatively privileged in socioeconomic terms, and I cannot readily hide that fact when out and about in public due to my appearance, friend group, vehicle, and so on. 

To be clear, based on my personal experience in STX, I have been nearly run over in the street by a truck full of black men who screamed at my group to "get out of here you white bit*&es!". This type of event isn't a single occurrence. This happens at LEAST once a month via the quiet comments when I pass locals on the street, or in the stores, and especially at the airport. Comments like "leave this place" or "we don't want you here" are frequent. I'm not sure the men are addressed as directly from what I understand from those in my friend group (mostly f), but most of the white men I speak with have come from urban areas and notice they are treated differently. They are charged more at the festivals/events for a pate or a drink than that of their black counterparts for example. I have heard from other transplants that it is called the "white tax" and considered it a surcharge for existing here. It's probably more accurate to say this is a "class tax" and applied to people who look more affluent regardless of race. It's not even subtle. So, it exists, and I have accepted this fact in order to live here by choice. 

"It" exists and is becoming more prevalent over time. It's relatively benign in terms of overall experience, but I felt that people should know and understand that this is a feature (recent or not) of island living on STX; we who have had this experience should not try to sugar coat the day-to-day reality of dealing with being treated differently as white transplants. We who have had this experience deserve to be heard and acknowledged. 

Lastly, this island is small, and there is extreme wealth and poverty that coexists within ~84 sq. miles. This is bound to cause friction, and I believe "this" is the result of that disparity. I eat well and sleep comfortably, and from the looks of things the people that are acting out in this manner do not have it quite so great. That has to rub a bit...