Gay couple moving down island!

I forgot to ask if anybody can put me in touch with a gay couple with adopted children on one of the islands if you know of any
Thanks

Hello Albert.

I think that Virgin Islands law requires petitioners for adoption be VI residents and the child they wish to adopt to be present in the VI at the time the adoption petition is filed. Are you asking how islanders would feel about two gay men from the mainland petitioning to adopt a child of West Indian descent? West Indian culture is tolerant but deeply religious and conservative.

What if we decided to wait for a few years and adopt while still living in New York? Would the adoption still be considered legal in the VI if we moved down? And yes I want to know how islands would feel about two gay men having an adopted child.

Dear Albert,
Yes. there is a gay community here. Some not too nice but many very nice but they keep a very low profile and go to Puerto Rico for fun,
You can PM me for more info!

Albert,

The territory recognizes mainland adoptions so I imagine adopting in NY before establishing residency here would work but I am not an attorney and even an attorney may not be able to predict whether or not you will encounter legal problems with the VI government because the government is, well, unpredictable (corrupt.)

You should read this board to give you an idea of the cultural attitudes on island. A couple of weeks ago a woman wrote that she had a child, the father of the child was no longer in the picture by the time she delivered, and she had trouble getting the paperwork necessary to take the child back to the states. The territory does not work like the mainland and what you take for granted as reasonable there may not be customary here. Try to think of the US in USVI as decorative rather than substantive.

What continentals do is generally only of passing interest to most West Indians. I was trying to bring up the point that I believe islanders would have a lot to say if two gay continentals from NY tried to adopt a West Indian child.

Living in the island is totally different from living in NYC. You will develope closer personal friendship/aquintance in the V.I. than in the main land. Therefore, most will get to know you on a personal level, rather than saying hello only.
Islanders are very conservative individuals. Religion are taken very seriously. It is either you are a believer or not. Promoting gay life style is not something that is done on neither one of the islands. There are people that may believe one is born gay in the mainland/states, but on the island it is viewed as a negative life style that one developes based on the negativism of society.

On the island gay life style are openly critisied. A gay person might be a good individual, but are maily judged by their gay choice. Especially, not originally being from the island, this will be more than a difficult, and if feed into, it can become a battered decision to make such a move.

There are quite a number of gay couples and some singles on STX. While adopting a West Indian child might meet with some resistance, if you go the route so many others do and either adopt a child on the mainland or from Russia or Asia, etc., once you have legal documentation that this is your child, I doubt there is much the USVI government could or would do about it. It probably wouldn't come to any offical attention unless the child was abused in some way and child services came into the picture.

While the locals are religious and conservative, you would interact more with other transplants from the US mainland and Europe. After you've lived here a while, you might get to know more locals. They let you season a bit and see if you stick it out before they pursue friendships. That isn't to say that they aren't generally friendly, because they are.

Come on down for a visit and give the islands a try and see which one feels most like Home to you.

Thanks for everyones replies...actually we were considering international adoption from China, not from the islands. Either way the Virgin Islands are still an option but it does not seem like we would be accepted as would we in other of our moving options such as Hawaii where civil unions are legal.

Also, does anybody know of any Caribbean islands where homosexuality is more understood and accepted. I have heard that Martinique, Guadeloupe, and St Martin are legally accepting (the are part of France so they have civil unions), but i dunno about the society in general. I have also heard that the ABC islands are accepting but I have been to two of them and I cannot see myself living there.

So what islands are the most accepting?

Albert,

You ask about a place where homosexuality is more "understood and accepted" but these terms are vague, general concepts without any clear defining parameters. The places you're considering moving are in predominantly Christian societies. I don't think most adults in those locales misunderstand homosexuality so much as consider the practice of homosexuality sinful or aberrant so no matter where you go you will likely have to settle for tolerance from those outside your immediate community of friends. I know of no nation, in the Caribbean or elsewhere, where people are enthusiastic about homosexuality.

Saba and St. maartin (The Dutch side) have a fairly high gay population. Not much of a problem. Not even much of an issue or topic.

When I said understanding homosexuality, I was refering to what V.I. said:

"There are people that may believe one is born gay in the mainland/states, but on the island it is viewed as a negative life style that one developes based on the negativism of society."

The island view is the wrong view, the view that people are born gay is the one science supports...

And dntw8up, while no nation is "enthusiastic" about homosexuality, some nations are more accepting then others, for example, in Iran homosexuals are killed by the government, in Jamaica homosexuals are killed by the people, in the southeast US homosexuals are for the most part hated, and in NY homosexuals are tolerated by most and its usually a none issue.

So I want to move to a place where it may not be accepted, but at least tolerated and from the responces I have gotten, the islanders in the Vi do not seem to tolerate it.

Albert: I'd ask yourself who you expect your community is going to be down in the USVI. I would urge you to check it out yourself and not go on the generalizations posted on a computer board. You may find that USVI is the best option for you from a total lifestyle perspective.

If you have a partner and don't need immersion in a gay culture, you may be very happy on USVI. You may also find a community of people - both continentals and islanders, who are accepting of your lifestyle. The islands are loaded with artsy, creative types, among which I have circulated and in those communities people are very welcoming of gays and lesbians. My admittedly limited experience with Caribbean life in general is that people are much, much less uptight about the comings and goings of others. You may find that your "community" of friends is almost entirely white folks and your interaction with locals is limited to business relationships and casual acquaintances. That isn't inherently bad - it's human nature. We tend to congregate with people like ourselves.

As far as living on islands that are not US possessions, I have looked into moving to places like this and the process is much more onerous. While the USVI government may be corrupt, you at least have the rights of a US citizen while in the islands, which you would not if you were in other places. And you may find that your goal of adopting a child while living as a foreign national on another country's soil is logistically difficult if not impossible.

Albert,

Your generalizations do not ring true in my experience. For example, you claim, "In the southeast US homosexuals are for the most part hated" but I lived for many years in a small town in the southeast where the elected mayor was an openly gay male. There are pockets of people everywhere for whom homosexuality is not an issue, including the rural southeastern US and the USVI. You may have difficulty finding a place where homosexuality is embraced but there are plenty of people who don't care about your sexual orientation. You need to investigate the USVI, make several lengthy visits if possible, to try to determine whether or not you'd be comfortable here. There is a poster from MI on this board, Allen Kavanaugh, and he and his partner are working toward moving to St. Croix in a year. Perhaps he'd be willing to share some of his thoughts with you. You can search this board and read his posts and if you want to send him an email just click on his name.

Hey Albert,

My partner and I (together almost 15 years!) spent a couple of years researching and visiting several islands from the Dominican Republic to St.Vincent. We finally determined that St.Croix may meet all of our needs, and made a pre-move visit last summer. We fell in love with the island.

We are not a "flashy" gay couple either and never felt uncomfortable out and about while there. We had drinks and dinner at several great spots (Duggan's, Cheeseburgers, and The Galleon to name a few) and never encountered any homophobia.

We did contact a specific realtor (also gay) who showed us several condo's and houses, and we closed on a property in November. Since making our purchase we have also met another gay couple (who live near us in Providence,RI) who recently purchased a home on the island as well.

If you read the messages on this board, what comes up most often is the need to do a pre-move visit! Take that advice! At the very least you will have a wonderful vacation in the USVI and be able to make a decision that is right for you and your partner.

I think you and your parter will love St.Croix. Good luck and have fun with your search!

I have also been working with a gay couple from Florida who will be moving to STX this year as soon as their rental properties sell. They found STX very much to their taste when they spent time here a couple months ago and can't wait to be here full time. Neither of them said they experienced any discomfort from encountering homophobia or intolerance when they were out exploring.

For what its worth, have you looked at European islands at all? I'm thinking specifically of Ibizia, a Spanish island in the Mediterranean, part of the Menorca/Miorca (sp?) group. We went to Menorca only on vacation as a hetero couple but read repeatedly that Ibizia is very-pro gay. Fabulous area, very much island cultures, may be worth investigating???

You have not mentioned the type of work you will be doing professionally. Since you mention that you "just got out" of medical school, and if you are therefore thinking of a medical career - wouldn't you first want to consider where you live based on career opportunities?

Well thank you everyone, the last few responces made me change my mind entirely. I will still be investigating the USVI as a possible relocation spot.

From what it sounds like (i may be wrong), St. Croix has a gay population that has a lot of respect and power on the islands (gay realtors, business association) so maybe we will look there.

ProvRI- did you ever tell people you were a gay couple, my partner and I are not stereotypical at all so people usually ask us if we are college roommates out for dinner, and when we explain to people that we are gay they are sometimes surprised. Do you think the reactions may have been different had they known you were gay?

Island Paul- Before I started posting on this board, I called up a few medical offices on both St Thomas and St Croix and they both said they may need new help in the next few years.

And Smartbomb you are right, we have no interest in the gay community, we do not go to parades, we make friends that are both gay and straight but it doesn't matter to me which one they are.

So I think we may contact a realtor on St Croix and make a Pre-Move-Visit within the next 6 months!

Albert,

I am "one half" of the gay couple Alexandra mentioned. We have found St.Croix to be very accepting, We feel very comfortable there. I think it is like any other place, if you treat people with respect they will do the same.

If you are looking for a great Real Estate agent, I can certainly recommend Alexandra, she is great to work with.

So would people generally say that St Croix is more tolerating then st Thomas because of the more laid back attitude that presides? Because most of the gay couples on this board live in st croix (and they have a gay business assoc. so there most be some level of tolerance)

I am sorry to bombard people with questions, Its just that I do not wanna waste money on a PMV to two islands, I want one island to visit and I need to know which would be a better option.

Dear Albert,

Glad you're feeling better about things now and rest assured that whether you decide to park yourself on STT, STX or STJ, you'll be welcomed. It takes a while to become accepted here whatever your lifestyle because we're so used to seeing people coming and going.

However, once you become a member of the community, you'll find the diversity of the melting pot quite unique. Given time, even the most unaccepting homophobic locals will get to like you (most of them not even realizing that you're gay!)

I have many gay friends here, some of whom hold quite high positions in the community. With some of them I josh, some of them I don't because they prefer to keep their preference a closed book and others are so totally flamboyant Queen Bees! People here are adjudged more by what they do and how they conduct themselves rather than by their sexual preferences. Not unlike any small community.

When I moved from England to Connecticut in 1968, it took a long time before I was really accepted. When I moved here to STT in 1984, ditto - and I'm straight!

I guess the point I'm making is that whenever or wherever you move there are adjustments to be made. As an example, NYC is a seething metropolis but if you move there you have to fit in with the neighborhood in which you choose to live because the city is comprised of little sections from block to block. Same here.

Albeit very small islands, the little pocket communities exist as anywhere else. You do need to make a PMV (pre-move visit) and you'll find lots of information about them if you research this board.

As far as adoption is concerned, my suggestion is that you first get yourself comfortable with your partner in whichever new environment you decide to relocate to, find a community with which you're both comfortable and - only after you're truly a part of that community - go ahead with your adoption dream.

You're only 26, very young. Your whole life is ahead of you, both personally and professionally, and you have plenty of time to establish yourself with your partner in a new place before even thinking of adoption. If you find a nice place to live, a puppy or a kitten is always up for adoption and their life span is max about 20 years. A child is forever. Please do give a lot of thought to that aspect.

Cheers and good luck!

Albert,

I don't think anyone who has done a PMV to multiple islands would consider it a waste of money. St. Thomas and St. Croix are very different from each other in a myriad of ways, not all of them immediately obvious. It would be disingenuous for anyone who doesn't know you well to suggest to you which island you'd prefer. During a PMV you may well discover that you feel more comfortable on one island than you do on another for a reason unrelated to sexual orientation.