Crime in Our Community

Ironically with a "Crime in Our Community" thread going on, I receive an obvious threat from Marty on STT via PM.

See the title and PM he sent below.

Your idiotic posts

From: Marty on STT
To: Uttica
08/10/2009 08:09PM
I have refrained from replying to your incessantly moronic posts in the past, but when you attack me personally, I don't stand for it. Where and when can we meet, face to face, to clear up your obvious misconceptions about me?

Nobody question Marty's comments, he don't like!!!

What a f***in' dumb a**.

Welcome to the club. Don't respond.

I know a couple who was robbed at gunpoint on the North Shore. They called the VIPD and waited two hours for them to respond to a armed felony robbery. VIPD never showed, they drove themselves to the VIPD precinct.

I don't blame the officers, I think there was probably a traffic checkpoint going on. I hear rumors of underground criminals driving without seat belts who they are cracking down on.

Even after this couples horrible story, I still feel that if everyone was armed it could/would turn into a disaster.

Thanks Trade, I will not.

I agree that we have far too many elected representatives, but I doubt there would be sufficient support to reduce their numbers to seven, and I'm certain that there would be insufficient support for STJ with its population of 5,000 to have the same number of elected representatives as STT and STX with their 50,000+ populations each.

It works OK in the US Senate.

Unlike the US, the major issues affecting the VI are the same for most of the 100k residents. When you have 7 senators (instead of 15) working on a bill it is probably going to produce a better end product anyway. What situations could possibly arise where the 2 senators from STJ would negatively impact the outcome for STT or STX? Even if there was a situation, it would be rare.

Jules, thanks for the kind words. I may submit what I wrote, although slightly edited for brevity to the source, might not be a bad idea.

Quite coincidentally to what I wrote the Washington Post had an article today headlined "Old hiring habits die hard in DC Government." It talks about a lot of what I wrote about last night. http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/08/10/AR2009081002841.html

I definitely understand the concern with bloating government. I don't think the answer would be just to add another layer or two without shrinking the layer we have.

Setting up districts would be a great start at adding accountability but I still feel like the "little" things get overlooked here because the territorial government is (or should be) doing non municipal functions without having time to deal with the "little" things like potholes, abondoned cars, code enforcement etc.

Many municipalities in the US are far smaller than the USVI and have 7+ member town councils with a mayor, then sit underneath a county council that is 10 or so strong, underneath a state legislature that is even larger. I worked for one such town in Maryland back in highschool running their public access TV station. It was goofy but effective...with the varying levels of goverment working with, and sometimes even against each other in ways that often benefitted the people. It is a system with a proven track record across the U.S. and given our geographic disparity is even more fitting here. At the very least an island level of goverment and a territorial level of goverment would be something that I think would improve accountability.

Anyway, just throwing ideas out there...the one upshot of a system that has utterly failed is that almost anything you do would be an improvement!

Sean

Even after this couples horrible story, I still feel that if everyone was armed it could/would turn into a disaster.

I'm curious about this. Studies in the US have repeatedly demonstrated that it does notturn into a disaster. Are you saying Islanders are crazier, meaner, dumber or less civilized than the rest of the US? Do you think the honest citizens here are too immature or weak-minded or childlike to be able to handle the responsibility of being armed?

I would have to disagree with you. And if the police, government and ancillary groups won't stand up and do their jobs, then I will stand (and live) on my second amendment rights.

‘‘Are we at last brought to such humiliating and debasing degradation, that we cannot be trusted with arms for our defense? ... If our defense be the real object of having those arms, in whose hands can they be trusted with more propriety, or equal safety to us, as in our own hands?’’
— Patrick Henry

antiqueone:

I could imagine seeing ten people in a full restaurant legally armed (either in the VI or US). A couple of thugs with guns enter the restaurant (this part sounds familiar?). These ten people, legally armed, pull their weapons and open fire on the thugs.

Do they have sufficient training? Do they know where their bullits will land? What is behind their targets (innocent people, a child)? Do they accept the responsibility for those bullits whoever they kill? Do they point their gun and disarm the other nine in the restaurant? Do they hold a gun and an "I have a licence to carry in the other hand"?

DON'T HESITATE THE GUY NEXT TO YOU MAY SHOOT YOU FIRST!!!

I think that with the possibilty of one or more people in a gathering place being armed, the bad guys will think twice about going in.
Now with almost no one on island except the bad guys armed, what risk do they take?

Uttica~ you have good concerns. I am thinking that bad guys suddenly surrounded by gun holding (but not shooting) customers would be inclined to save their lives and run away. Bad guys always look for the easy mark. There are plenty around.
But as to concealed carriers: I am strongly in favor of classes/training for those who are willing to carry so that they would understand the laws,techniques, and responsibilities of carrying a lethal weapon. I am in favor of licensing requiring testing for concealed carry permits. Legal gun ownership in the islands currently requires a background check and is fairly time consuming to obtain. I would like to see reform here, but I think what is happening now is not overly unreasonable.

Concealed carriers are responsible people. They could be your dentist, your doctor, the local shop owner. The hoops you have to go through to be a legal carrier of a lethal weapon weans out the crazies. To fire a weapon legally, you are absolutely responsible for the bullet from the moment it leaves your gun until it stops. If you hit an innocent bystander, you are responsible and will go to jail (except here in the VI where everybody seems to get off! :S ) It is a huge responsibility and not taken lightly. However studies of places like Texas and Florida where concealed carry permits were made easier to obtain showed 1. a significant decrease in violent crime 2. No "Wild West" attitude 3. In fact not a huge increase in actual permits. It is thought that perhaps the bad guys, knowing there might be return fire moved on to easier pickings, like California and Washington DC.

A free people ought not only to be armed and disciplined, but they should have sufficient arms and ammunition to maintain a status of independence from any who might attempt to abuse them, which would include their own government." George Washington

John F. Kennedy: "Today, we need a nation of Minutemen, citizens who are not only prepared to take arms, but citizens who regard the preservation of freedom as the basic purpose of their daily life and who are willing to consciously work and sacrifice for that freedom."

good morning

as far as guns go...if you carry...be responsible, trained and WILLING to shoot without hesitation.
bullets have no eyes.

In order to have a legal handgun and a permit to carry, you must go through a course at the VI Marksman Asso as well as a thorough background check.

Note I said LEGAL.

On most issues, my views are pretty liberal. But my views concerning firearms changed since moving to St. Croix.

In theory, restrictions regarding firearms makes sense. In practice, tight restrictions have the effect of making legal gun ownership difficult and do little to stop the flow of weapons to the criminals. I've also come to the conclusion that I am the only one responsible for the protection of my family.

So as onerous as it is to get a concealed permit, my wife and I are getting one. We will avoid the places, times, and situations that can lead to violence. But we're not going to pack up and leave our home.

My husband and I have spent hours investigating the idea of a year move to the VI The article on crime has discouraged us somewhat. Is life on the island that bad/dangerous. Should we be discouraged?

i heard today the carambola guy was burned and had a couple of fingernails pulled out before he was shot and it was all over drugs

was thinking of moving to VI for a year, but reading message board on crime is discouraging me. Is it that bad/dangerous?

Well CJ, those of us who are discussing crime on this forum choose to live here and not somewhere else. We are coming together as a community on this forum to discuss and to try to find solutions for our problems. Most of us have the ability to move elsewhere if living here were to become untenable, so the fact that we are still here speaks for itself.

If I thought that a bar/restaurant was full of people carrying guns, I would not enter. The odds of some of those people not being trained enough or capable enough to carry is just too high. And then you add in alcohol...lol. Nope, not for me.

CJ what dntw8up said.

Linda J I would take long odds people are already packing (guns and knives) in places you go - you just are not aware of it.
How many have metal scanners?
Are you going to hide in your home?
Oops that didn't work for Michigan Linda did it?

CJ I live on STX and have been here for a while. I have never been a victim of any crime (knock on wood). Most of the violent crime here is locals against locals having domestic disputes drug dealing or rage from being dissed. Generally if you are careful and avoid being out really late or go out with a group you will have no trouble. It is my observation that we the citizens want and are demanding change and with elections coming soon we will get it. The govt is acutely aware how upset we are and how this issue is tarnishing our image and will take action or they will all loose their dream jobs. Come on down for a visit and form your own opinion, meanwhile we will voice our outrage and be sure that we are being heard. The VI is an incredible place with incredible people.

Interesting reading these posts, I'm not been on this board for some time.

Observation, although it may be off-the-mark:

A woman gets into a car after consuming a large quantity of alcohol and drugs, drives the wrong way on a freeway, and kills eight people including all three siblings of one family and a father and son of another.

A man walks into a gymnasium and, with a burning hatred for women, opens fire with two handguns and kills three of them before killing himself.

A man leads police on a high-speed car chase and kills seven people as he tries to make his getaway.

Conclusion: if you think it is safer somewhere else, go there...otherwise, try to present constructive solutions to our issues here. There are one thousand hacking at the branches of evil to one who is striking at the root. The root causes of violence are numerous, and most of them involve money. Try telling DISH network to stop showing violent movies that glorify guns. We create breeding grounds for beasts, and then act surprised when they appear.

If you stay away from the pit-bull breeders/fighters and the drug dealers you will be fine. You will find crime anywhere you go on planet earth. The VI is a wonderful place to live and raise a family, but you have to keep your wits about you. It is not paradise, it just comes pretty close. We have our share of demons that are yet to be banished.

just talked to a man and his wife. they were on the board walk last night watching the tarpoons in front of rumrunners. here comes a man walking down boardwalk with a gun. police headed him off from all drections of boardwalk (angry nates way and brewpub direction) and from the side. they told him to drop it. what turned out to be ok could have been much worse. innocent people on the
boardwalk. and you wonder where the gun with had been or where he was going?????

and it was still day light with tourists around. we don't have to email anderson cooper.....given enough time he will hear about us on his own and it won't be good either.

If you stay away from the pit-bull breeders/fighters and the drug dealers you will be fine. You will find crime anywhere you go on planet earth. The VI is a wonderful place to live and raise a family, but you have to keep your wits about you. It is not paradise, it just comes pretty close. We have our share of demons that are yet to be banished.

Well said indeed.

I've got no horse in this race, but I believe your analogies don't hold up. I believe the people here are generally talking 'street crime', crimes of opportunity.

There is still some questions on whether the woman had ingested the drugs or alcohol.